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Dec 28, 2009, 10:50am

Creating Relics :: Writing Extras :: Writing Tips and Questions :: Elements of Fanfiction

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Topic: Elements of Fanfiction (Read 119 times)

fyrethief
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Elements of Fanfiction
« Thread Started on Aug 17, 2007, 12:13am »

In this http://creatingrelics.proboards42.com/index.cgi?board=feedback&action=display&thread=1187127327&page=1]thread[/url], Katy wrote:

"You know, I get twitchy over descriptions - I actually *love* them, writing them and reading them, but in fanfic, particularly, I'm always terrified of getting bogged down in detail, and that I bore people who were looking for character and interaction. I was interested, when you describe them as ' economical ', because I suppose that is how my writing has evolved in response. When I tried to start writing a novel three years ago, which I'm now redrafting, the whole first chapter was description of a journey. I realised nobody would ever want to read it... I've guess, but I've been trying to find that happy medium.

I'd be interesting to know what other people feel when they write fanfic, whether they get nervous in the same way that people will be bored of anything which isn't strictly related to the characters... maybe we could chat about this another column if anybody's interested? Another thing I'm always nervous of is building up my ' other characters'. I tend to keep their scenes brief, and the characters fairly one-dimensional... but am I underestimating what people are looking for? With you guys reading, of course, I feel more comfortable in branching out a bit... but for a general fanfic audience, I'd still be worried about too much of my own input...hmmm, that was rambly. I hope it made some vague sense."

Taking up on Katy's suggestion, here is the other "column" -- discuss please!

(And there are many points here to discuss!)

---

My thoughts (or long, rambly mutterings too late at night):

Regarding descriptions, I think a writer does need to find that "happy medium". I've read books before that have nearly bored me to tears because they've spent 10 pages describing a tree or a rock; at the same time, I like to be able to see the places and the people as well as hear them. When it comes to character description, personally I like it when it's done subtly over a long period of time (little comments dropped here and there) or in a new, ingenious way. Although I'm not condemning it universally (for some writing styles or stories it works perfectly), it does irritate me when an author (fanfiction or otherwise) will always use a set pattern for introducing and describing a character: "this is X. (S)he has X colour hair, of X length, and X colour eyes". It infuriates me even more when I read back and discover I've done exactly that!

And, Katy, about your novel-that-no-one-would-want-to-read -- I think sometimes we have to get that sort of writing style out of our system.

Like, we have to play around with everything so that we can discard it for something better.

As far as economy with words goes... Well, as you probably know, I'm mostly Welsh. Which means I can easily talk the hind legs off a donkey, and any everyday tale (in real life) has to be told from the very beginning, with every little detail! Unfortunately, this transfers across to my writing and I'm very aware of trying to prevent it from becoming heavy, bogged-down, and lengthy beyond need. I had a great lesson once, when I gave a piece of writing to one of my best friends, whose ability with words I admired as much as any of my favourite published authors; she returned my work with nearly every single line covered in red pen. Most frequently, she had written "is this necessary??" or "you don't need this" -- and that, I believe, is the single most important thing I've ever learnt with regards to my writing. So, urm, the whole point of this waffley thing was to say that I think economy of words is very important, and even now I find it very hard to achieve. (As you can see from this post, the length of which I am a tad embarrassed about.)

Quote:

whether they get nervous in the same way that people will be bored of anything which isn't strictly related to the characters

I get worried people will be bored because of the reasons I talked of above, but not because of not sticking to characters. In fact, that's quite a new thought to me! I admit that a fanfic needs to be in character for it to be properly enjoyable, but I enjoy every aspect of a story. (Well, generally speaking.) If a story had no description or bits between the characterisation, you'd soon lose the juice of the story, I think! You'd have to be pretty skilled to carry on a good story just solely around a few character interactions.

As far as 'other characters', I assume you mean your own original characters that you put into fanfic? I think fanfic writers have to be extra careful here; too often I've seen supposedly side-line original characters spring up into the limelight, but causing the readers nothing but pain at their poor development, or dwindle into nothingness and seem completely pointless for being in the story to begin with. If 'other characters' are well thought out, with credible faults as well as strengths, with a good reason to be in the story (not some half-baked flimsy excuse for a connection), then I love reading them. In a way, you're writing both original work and fanfiction and combining them in a way that has to flow -- and that's clever.

In general Katy, I treat fanfiction differently to original writing. It's not something I do on purpose, I've just naturally adjusted to it. I find I write fanfic with much more laxness: I'll use many more colloquialisms, direct speech becomes more important and introspection less so, and I often spend more time trying to move it on in the plot than hanging around with in-between scenes. I guess it seems to work okay!

I'm really sorry for the long post! :-[

Clearly I shouldn't try to respond to Katy's thought-provoking questions late at night!

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tanyareed
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Re: Elements of Fanfiction
« Reply #1 on Aug 17, 2007, 2:02am »

I find this discussion fascinating, mostly because--as I've probably mentioned a million times--my problem is always the opposite. I'm always afraid that I don't have enough description and that I haven't done the description right. I often wonder if I rely too much on dialogue to set my scenes and that I'm not giving enough of a picture for people to see what they need to to enjoy the story. Because of this, I sometimes experiment with descripiton to see if I can change the flavour (hence my sound experiment at the beginning of "Need".) Anyway, because of my problem with description, I'm always asking, "Can you see this? Can you feel this?" Just ask Katy.

I must have badgered her to death about that with "Blood and Alcohol". So, in short form to Katy's question, yes I do worry that people will get bored with my story and stop reading--not because I've used to much description but because I didn't use enough and they just lose interest because they can't get into the story. Description has always been my main bane.

I don't think you should worry, Katy--I think this is what you're getting at, only not as strictly as I'm making it sound--that people want fanfiction to be completely formulaic with none of your own creativity in it. There are as many different kinds of fan fiction fans as there is fan fic. You have to write for yourself first. Chances are if you like your version of the characters and the storyline someone else will like it too. Embrace the other elements and characters in your plot, make them the best that you can and don't worry so much about sticking to a formula. Look at how far out of the box *I* go sometimes. I haven't had anyone tell me I suck yet.

Hmmnn...Gem, I never thought about whether I treat fanfiction differently than I do orginal stuff, but I dont' think I do. I think I allow myself to be as uninhibited and creative in fanfiction as I do in any of my own creations. Maybe that means that I'm not very discplined in my original stuff, I don't know...That's something to think about.

Anyway, that's all I can think to say on the topic at the moment. I'm sure i'll have more later.

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katia
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Re: Elements of Fanfiction
« Reply #2 on Aug 17, 2007, 6:00pm »

Wow, thanks guys. There's so much to think about here!

This is going to be rambly as I'm in a bit of a hurry...

Firstly, I think I'm with you guys on description - some writers are very sparse, but I like to be able to picture what people look like, the setting and, although not quite as essential at all times, I'm quite keen to know what their expressions and how they physically responding to the story... funnily enough, that is almost the most important thing to being fanfic, as when I write I can constantly picture the characters in my head. Although, back on the same tack, I also worry about overwriting these things when people who know the characters might be a will to picture them just as well, if not better than me...

Angie - like you, (as you know;)) I'm always keen to find out if readers can sense the emotion that I can. I do get quite emotional writing my stories - I've cried, I got up and jumped around the room with excitement (okay, I do the latter quite often - suddenly I found over at your side of the flat, just because I'm so carried away in the story... okay, now you think I'm really weird

) but getting it across is what matters, and I guess that practice is the only way to achieve that... trial and error, as Gem suggests

He he, your friends sounds like one of my professors, Gem. I've often got history papers back with red pen and ' you don't need this' scribbled all over it. However, I learnt a lot from her, which I actually now apply to my fiction writing...

... rambling along from that to another point of discussion, I'm also a little more casual in fanfic writing with colloquialisms and everything. It's not because I don't take fan fiction quite a seriously, but somehow it so often fits right into the thoughts and dialogue... however, I try to avoid it in my description, even though it occasionally slips in.

"In a way, you're writing both original work and fanfiction and combining them in a way that has to flow -- and that's clever"

I think thats something for me to work towards...I'm not there yet... I might challenge myself on my next fic to concentrate more on getting that balance you suggest with O/Cs rights....

Angie, hmmm, yes you're right. I think its best to think just unleash...'go with the flow' I guess.

Well, Im sure I'll be back here later with more to say...just going to post my next bits of story...then better cook tea

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fyrethief
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Re: Elements of Fanfiction
« Reply #3 on Aug 20, 2007, 10:44am »

Angie, I never have a problem "seeing" your stories so you obviously have enough description!

Quote:

people want fanfiction to be completely formulaic with none of your own creativity in it.

I think that sums it up wonderfully well. It's such a shame that fans feel like that.

Quote:

although not quite as essential at all times, I'm quite keen to know what their expressions and how they physically responding to the story...

Katy, I'm always putting in little things about what the characters are doing! I sometimes worry that I've put too much of it in, but I've read too that it's a key method to making your characters 3D.

Quote:

I'm also a little more casual in fanfic...It's not because I don't take fan fiction quite a seriously, but somehow it so often fits right into the thoughts and dialogue

I agree - it just seems right.

I've realised a new problem: I tend to think of the multi-chapter fanfics as novels, not fanfics! So I make them too long and too complicated! :-/

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katia
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Re: Elements of Fanfiction
« Reply #4 on Aug 20, 2007, 1:32pm »

This will be a quick response, as I have to go out, but there are a couple of points here that interest me immensely...

Quote:

people want fanfiction to be completely formulaic with none of your own creativity in it.

I think that sums it up wonderfully well. It's such a shame that fans feel like that.

This is one of the reasons I'm quite excited about this site. I do feel, on fan fiction net, that most people do like stories to be quite true to the show. I think it's fair enough that people want to read stories like that - after all, the main reason they are coming to of stories is because they are 'relic Hunter' stories but, as a writer, it can be very limiting and I think there is an audience for both, even if it is a slightly limited one. Indeed, I've started to consciously try and write 'both' kind of stories. In the future, I'm hoping to put my more 'branching-out' stories here and leave the more ' true to the show' ones for fan fiction net.

Gem - "I've realised a new problem: I tend to think of the multi-chapter fanfics as novels, not fanfics! So I make them too long and too complicated! :-/

[/quote]

Ah, now, is that a problem? I suppose, in answer to myself, I often worry about it immensely, so maybe it is! I like writing long stories - I think of my longest fan fics as novelettes too - and adding many plot points and complications. My longer story, so far, is about 90,000 words. I *do* worry about boring people, and sustaining reader interest, however, had JRR Tolkien, Terry Goodkind, Charles Dickens, George Eliot, William Makepeace Thackarey etc etc done the same, we would have missed out on some of the most wonderful books ever written!! I suppose, like with stories that divulge from canon, you are going to get less readers... but, very possibly, more satisfaction for yourself and more satisfaction for the readers who take the time to engage with it. Keep up those long stories, Gem!!!! It's great novel practice, at the very least...

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